Fake Händler

[Schattenparker35610]

Bislang bin ich mit meiner Suche nicht auf die entsprechenden Threads gestoßen deswegen bitte ich um Entschuldigung, wenn ich hier ein Thema eröffne was an andere Stelle schon mehrfach besprochen wurde (btw ein Link wäre nett).

Ich stoße bei meiner Gebrauchtwagensuche, egal ob via Autoscout24 oder mobile.de immer wieder auf Händler, die nur den Kontakt per mail wünschen und relativ neuwertige Gebrauchtwagen zu 50% unter dem Marktwert anbieten.

Teilweise stoße ich dabei auf schnell erstellte Internetseiten wo direkt dutzende von Wagen zu o.g. Konditionen angeboten werden.

Aktuelles Beispiel:

http://www.mdautomobile.de/

Einerseits weiß ich natürlich das es nicht mit rechten Dingen zugehen kann, wenn ich einen 2006 RS4 der gerade mal 50TKM gelaufen ist für 18.000€ hinterherschmißen kriege, andererseits möchte ich gerade deswegen wissen welche dubiosen Machenschaften dahinter stecken! Sind die Fahrzeuge geklaut? Was steckt dahinter?

Falls jemand näheres weiß oder eventuell auch schonmal Erfahrung mit solchen Händlern gemacht hat, würde ich mich sehr über eine Antwort freuen.

 

[Rostlöser49847]

Sind nicht geklaut, diese Fahrzeuge existieren zumeist garnicht. Die klauen sich irgendwo im Netz Bilder, wenn Du den Wagen haben willst musst Du leider vorkasse machen. Vielleicht erwischt Du aber den ersten, der wirklich was verschenken will-viel Glück ;-)

[Federspanner1794]

Das sind meist gehackte mobile.de Accounts Dahinter stecken osteuropäische Banden, die Angebote sind wie in dem von dir geschilderten Fall schnell wieder verschwunden. Scheinbar gibts aber noch genug Idioten die auf sowas reinfallen

[Dr.Zulassung]

Ganz einfache Masche die schon im TV gezeigt wurde und von den Betrügern selber gezeigt wurde (sind sich ihrer Sache sehr sicher).

Das Fahrzeug gibt es wie gesagt nicht und die Bilder kann man ja überall im Netz kopieren.

Die bieten die Fahrzeuge an und wollen einen kleinen Vorschuss haben für den Wagen. Dieser muss nicht immer sehr hoch sein, vllt. auch mal nur 1000€.

Zahlt ein Kunde das Geld dann ist das Angebot weg und man macht einen neuen Account und erstellt neue Angebote, teilweise mit gleichem Text und Bildern.

Das sind organisierte Banden meistens aus Osteuropa oder die gehen über Länder wie Isle of Man, etc. die ja keine Kontrollen vornehmen.

[Federspanner1794]

Der vom TE gepostete Account besteht seit 2003! Was du meinst sind die gefakten Privatinserate, hier sind es gehackte Händlerseiten. An die Passwörtern sidn sie über Phishing-Attacken gekommen!

[Schattenparker35610]

Zitat:

Original geschrieben von Dr.Zulassung

Ganz einfache Masche die schon im TV gezeigt wurde und von den Betrügern selber gezeigt wurde (sind sich ihrer Sache sehr sicher).

Danke für die Aufklärung, ich habe kein TV, oder besser gesagt ich schau kein TV - von daher war mir die Masche auch nicht bekannt.

 

Um mir trotzdem ein eigenes Bild von der Sache zu machen, habe ich mir via msm ein email konto angelegt und mal über mobile auf eine solche Anzeige geantwortet, den e-mail Verkehr möchte ich euch nicht vorenthalten:

 

Zitat:

Subject: 2004-[MAZDA RX-8 REVOLUTION -]-4 - 5000 EUR

> > > From: [e-mail]

> > > Dear buyer,

> > >

> > > I hope English is fine for you, otherwise, please let me know so I

> > try to answer your Email in German but I will use a web translator for

> > that.

> > >

> > > First of all I have to appologize for not answering my Email and

> > Mobile phone, but I am on a business trip for two weeks, with really

> > limited chance to answer Calls and Emails.

> > >

> > > I will be back from my business trip tomorrow late evening, so we

> > can discuss more details regarding my car.Is this fine for you.

> > >

> > > To discribe the car a little more..... The car is really well kept

> > from inside and outside.The car was parked in a garage all the time,

> > plus it has not been smoked at any time, so the car is very well kept.

> > >

> > > I guess you have already seen/read all other details in mobile.de:

> > > - air condition

> > > - bord computer

> > > - radio + CD

> > > - special sportive car seats

> > > - sportive adjustable steering wheel

> > > - electric adjustable exterior mirror

> > > -electric windows

> > > - foglights

> > > - snow tires

> > > - etc....

> > >

> > > I hope you are still interested so please let me know .I have

> > attached some pictures with the car so you can see the real state

> > > of my car.

> > >

> > > Best Regards,

> > > Andrew

Daraufhin meine Antwort:

Zitat:

Dear Andrew,

> >

> > yes i´m still interested for your RX8.

> > My English is not the best, but I think its ok to clarify some points

> > of view.

> >

> > I think we both know that there is something shady/dubious on this

> > car, if you offer it less then 50% of the normal market price.

> >

> > So let me tell you one thing, I don’t care if the car is from east

> > Europe, or stolen or something like that! - If the car is in proper

> > condition, the engine works and the papers are ok.

> >

> > In that fact i´m interested to buy the car directly.

> > If you want some advance payment - forget my mail!!!

> > Otherwise just tell me a day and a location in Germany where we can

> > meet, make a short contract and I will pay cash 5000€ and take the car.

> >

> > Best regards

Was wiederrum zu einer langen, insich unstimmigen mail führte:

Zitat:

> From: [e-mail]

} Subject: Re: 2004-[MAZDA RX-8 REVOLUTION -]-4 - 5000 EUR

>

> Hello again,

>

> Sorry for my slow answer. I wanna be honest with you from the

> beginning, I bought the car from Germany and brought to London, my

> residential place.I have two cars,this car and also another family

> car.Few months ago I divorced from my wife and due to the

> divorce(dissolution of marriage) I kept this car and a part of the goods

> of the family.As I want to tell you from the beginning I am working as

> a branch manager and I am detached all most the time where the company

> open a new branch .I think I will not use this car so much because I

> don't have enough time and also in London or Norway where I am detached

> right now is very hard to drive an European model like this,with all the

> controls on the left side in a right sided country like United

> Kingdom.Also as a branch manager I travel always by plane abroad and in

> Norway or where I am detached I have a car from the company.I think I've

> told you enough about me and I don't want to stress you anymore with my

> story and I will tell you more about the car.I want to let you know the

> car has German papers ( German 'Export Plates'-in German it

> say“Ausfuhrkennzeichen”- for one year and also the German vehicle tax

> (Kraftfahrzeugsteuer) paid for one year,TUV and COC(certificate of

> Conformity).With these plates you can drive the car all over Europe,from

> London for example to Germany or any country and in this mode you can

> return with the car in your country and register without any

> problem(because the number plates are valid for one year,until

> 02.2010).Comparing it with other cars, the price is a little bit low and

> I am aware of it, that's why I need to explain it to you:it has the

> steering wheel on the left side making driving hard for me in UK, so I

> have to to sell it in another country.I have a friend who speaks a

> little bit German and he helped me placing the Internet ad on

> www.mobile.de,he told me that I will sell the car on this web site in no

> time.I'm not an expert on cars but I can ensure you that it is in

> perfect conditions and it never had any problems with the engine,it has

> never been crashed and the maintenance was made by authorized service,

> the service book confirms it.The car is cleared of any obligations or

> fees and comes with all the documents you need to register it and you

> will not have to pay additional taxes for this .Also I have

> summer/winter tires for the car.Also On the www.mobile.de website there

> are some mistakes regarding the address where the car can be viewed

> ,it's listed in Germany because when i have posted the car on the

> website I had to use a German address and this is the reason of this

> mistake.I would like to make this deal in person, but it will be very

> hard because I have a lot of work to do in Norway(as I told you earlier

> the company I work for opens a new branch there and it seems I am the

> only capable branch manager they have) Don't worry, the car remained in

> London(is still in London). It is hard for me to skip work now, so I

> need insurance that you will come to London,in case you decide you want

> to buy the car. So if you are interested in purchasing my car, please

> let me know and we will find a solution to meet in person and complete

> the deal.

> I wish you a nice day

> Andrew Waterson

Woraufhin ich ihm nahe legte das ich den Wagen auch ohne Probleme in London abholen könnte...

Zitat:

Hi

 

Sounds a little bit complex, but I think we could arrange a meeting.

In the moment i´m also working in Norway – my company has a subcontract for statoil and i´m travelling for my job as project manager twice a month to mongstad (Norway). Next time I will travel back from Norway on 16.12.2009 – SO, instead taking flight to germany I could arrange a flight from Oslo to London – we can make the contract, and I could travel back with the car by ferry or Eurotunnel.

So let me know if you have time overnext week.

 

Best regards

Und nun habe ich seit 2 Tagen nichts mehr gehört XD

[Federspanner1794]

Schau dir mal den obersten Fred im Sicherheitsforum an! Das ist eine seit lange bekannte Masche, scheinbar hat sie sich noch nicht bei allen rumgesprochen.

[Spiralschlauch17165]

Ja Leute ,

ich habe die selben mails zu einem anderen Fahrzeug erhalten. Als ich Andrew Waterson gegoogelt habe bin ich bei euch gelandet ... [e-mail] ist die mailadresee von diesem riesen Arschl... habe male alle Schimpfwörter und schlimmsten Neujahrswünsche gesendet. hahahaha

Danke an Euch

Zitat:

Original geschrieben von Mindless75

Zitat:

Subject: 2004-[MAZDA RX-8 REVOLUTION -]-4 - 5000 EUR

> > > From: [e-mail]

> > > Dear buyer,

> > >

> > > I hope English is fine for you, otherwise, please let me know so I

> > try to answer your Email in German but I will use a web translator for

> > that.

> > >

> > > First of all I have to appologize for not answering my Email and

> > Mobile phone, but I am on a business trip for two weeks, with really

> > limited chance to answer Calls and Emails.

> > >

> > > I will be back from my business trip tomorrow late evening, so we

> > can discuss more details regarding my car.Is this fine for you.

> > >

> > > To discribe the car a little more..... The car is really well kept

> > from inside and outside.The car was parked in a garage all the time,

> > plus it has not been smoked at any time, so the car is very well kept.

> > >

> > > I guess you have already seen/read all other details in mobile.de:

> > > - air condition

> > > - bord computer

> > > - radio + CD

> > > - special sportive car seats

> > > - sportive adjustable steering wheel

> > > - electric adjustable exterior mirror

> > > -electric windows

> > > - foglights

> > > - snow tires

> > > - etc....

> > >

> > > I hope you are still interested so please let me know .I have

> > attached some pictures with the car so you can see the real state

> > > of my car.

> > >

> > > Best Regards,

> > > Andrew

Daraufhin meine Antwort:

Zitat:

Original geschrieben von Mindless75

Zitat:

Dear Andrew,

> >

> > yes i´m still interested for your RX8.

> > My English is not the best, but I think its ok to clarify some points

> > of view.

> >

> > I think we both know that there is something shady/dubious on this

> > car, if you offer it less then 50% of the normal market price.

> >

> > So let me tell you one thing, I don’t care if the car is from east

> > Europe, or stolen or something like that! - If the car is in proper

> > condition, the engine works and the papers are ok.

> >

> > In that fact i´m interested to buy the car directly.

> > If you want some advance payment - forget my mail!!!

> > Otherwise just tell me a day and a location in Germany where we can

> > meet, make a short contract and I will pay cash 5000€ and take the car.

> >

> > Best regards

Was wiederrum zu einer langen, insich unstimmigen mail führte:

Zitat:

Original geschrieben von Mindless75

Zitat:

> From: [e-mail]

} Subject: Re: 2004-[MAZDA RX-8 REVOLUTION -]-4 - 5000 EUR

>

> Hello again,

>

> Sorry for my slow answer. I wanna be honest with you from the

> beginning, I bought the car from Germany and brought to London, my

> residential place.I have two cars,this car and also another family

> car.Few months ago I divorced from my wife and due to the

> divorce(dissolution of marriage) I kept this car and a part of the goods

> of the family.As I want to tell you from the beginning I am working as

> a branch manager and I am detached all most the time where the company

> open a new branch .I think I will not use this car so much because I

> don't have enough time and also in London or Norway where I am detached

> right now is very hard to drive an European model like this,with all the

> controls on the left side in a right sided country like United

> Kingdom.Also as a branch manager I travel always by plane abroad and in

> Norway or where I am detached I have a car from the company.I think I've

> told you enough about me and I don't want to stress you anymore with my

> story and I will tell you more about the car.I want to let you know the

> car has German papers ( German 'Export Plates'-in German it

> say“Ausfuhrkennzeichen”- for one year and also the German vehicle tax

> (Kraftfahrzeugsteuer) paid for one year,TUV and COC(certificate of

> Conformity).With these plates you can drive the car all over Europe,from

> London for example to Germany or any country and in this mode you can

> return with the car in your country and register without any

> problem(because the number plates are valid for one year,until

> 02.2010).Comparing it with other cars, the price is a little bit low and

> I am aware of it, that's why I need to explain it to you:it has the

> steering wheel on the left side making driving hard for me in UK, so I

> have to to sell it in another country.I have a friend who speaks a

> little bit German and he helped me placing the Internet ad on

> www.mobile.de,he told me that I will sell the car on this web site in no

> time.I'm not an expert on cars but I can ensure you that it is in

> perfect conditions and it never had any problems with the engine,it has

> never been crashed and the maintenance was made by authorized service,

> the service book confirms it.The car is cleared of any obligations or

> fees and comes with all the documents you need to register it and you

> will not have to pay additional taxes for this .Also I have

> summer/winter tires for the car.Also On the www.mobile.de website there

> are some mistakes regarding the address where the car can be viewed

> ,it's listed in Germany because when i have posted the car on the

> website I had to use a German address and this is the reason of this

> mistake.I would like to make this deal in person, but it will be very

> hard because I have a lot of work to do in Norway(as I told you earlier

> the company I work for opens a new branch there and it seems I am the

> only capable branch manager they have) Don't worry, the car remained in

> London(is still in London). It is hard for me to skip work now, so I

> need insurance that you will come to London,in case you decide you want

> to buy the car. So if you are interested in purchasing my car, please

> let me know and we will find a solution to meet in person and complete

> the deal.

> I wish you a nice day

> Andrew Waterson

Woraufhin ich ihm nahe legte das ich den Wagen auch ohne Probleme in London abholen könnte...

Zitat:

Hi

 

Sounds a little bit complex, but I think we could arrange a meeting.

In the moment i´m also working in Norway – my company has a subcontract for statoil and i´m travelling for my job as project manager twice a month to mongstad (Norway). Next time I will travel back from Norway on 16.12.2009 – SO, instead taking flight to germany I could arrange a flight from Oslo to London – we can make the contract, and I could travel back with the car by ferry or Eurotunnel.

So let me know if you have time overnext week.

 

Best regards[/quote

Und nun habe ich seit 2 Tagen nichts mehr gehört XD

[helmutauto]

Und wozu machst Du Dir die ganze Arbeit? Hat die gleiche Wirkung, als wenn in Hamburg eine Schaufel umfällt.

[Federspanner1794]

Wenn jetzt jeder seine Konversation postet wirds ziemlich langweilig und unübersichtlich, auch wenns gut gemeint ist!

[Howard Dillier]

Zitat:

Original geschrieben von selbemasche

Ja Leute ,

ich habe die selben mails zu einem anderen Fahrzeug erhalten. Als ich Andrew Waterson gegoogelt habe bin ich bei euch gelandet ... [e-mail] ist die mailadresee von diesem riesen Arschl... habe male alle Schimpfwörter und schlimmsten Neujahrswünsche gesendet. hahahaha

Danke an Euch

Hallo selbemasche

Ich seh's nich so eng.

Das ist doch auch nur eine Arbeit.!?

'n Job iss doch (fast) immer g-u-t.

Das sind diejenigen, die wir dann weniger beim Sozialamt haben.

Oder kaßieren die gleich doppelt?

Sonnigen Gruß Howard

[Federspanner1794]

@Howard Dillier: Welche Drogen nimmst du, dass du Verbrechen als Job bezeichnest und das ganze auch noch gut heißt?

[Howard Dillier]

Hallo ThePilot

Liegt vielleicht daran daß ich mich gelegentlich in dem Milieu bewege.

Aber der passat scheint seiner zu sein, dünkt mich teuer, für'n 98ér Modell 3k€ €uronen zu löhnen.

Vermutlich will er sich damit - wohl mit Erfolg - ins rechte Licht rücken.

Von dem hat er auch richtig viele Bilder.

http://home.mobile.de/.../showDetails.html?...

Sonnigen Gruß Howard

P.S.: & edit 6 Edith meine noch schnell dazu;

Wenn der die selbe Geschichte bei dem Audi A4 Touring bringt, dann hat der 'n Knall in der Schüßel.

Kennzeichen aus EN, Auto steht aber im Engelland.

http://home.mobile.de/.../showDetails.html?...

[Federspanner1794]

Was willst du mir mit dieser Antwort sagen? Der eine Link geht nicht und warum manche Händler scheinbar so günstige Autos anbieten hab ich auch schon erklärt! Bei so einem ernsten Thema sind deine Antworten mehr als deplaziert!

[Howard Dillier]

Hallo ThePilot

Also sooo ernst ist das Thema ja nun auch nicht.

Sonnigen Gruß Howard